On Grounds for Judicial Review

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While the proposed Judicial Review of the LNS decision is to be welcomed it is a position that is fraught with legal difficulties such as the capacity to raise the proceedings, potential time bars and all sorts of other arguments.

It would be complete folly to base an argument here solely upon a judicial review of LNS as that would only leave one string to the bow.

Further, take the stated opinion or Mr Rod McKenzie that LNS only dealt with the issue of Player Registrations within the SPL/SPFL — and nothing else.

Any analysis of what is meant by that statement (and others made by Neil Doncaster) leads to the conclusion that there are other matters to be considered which were outwith the tight and narrow remit handed to LNS by the SPFL.

For me, the clearest consideration is this.

1. Craig Whyte has already been personally convicted by the SFA for deliberately failing to pay taxes as and when they fall due under article 5.1 of the SFA rules.

2. No such charge has ever been levied against RFC — just against their CEO.

3. Not only did RFC fail to pay taxes as and when they became due under Whyte’s watch, they deliberately failed to pay taxes for a 13 year period under the stewardship of Sir David Murray. They did this by deliberately entering into two unlawful tax aggressive tax avoidance schemes which even their advisers warned them could only be undertaken at considerable risk to the club as the schemes were never guaranteed to be successful.

4. Those schemes were entered into so that the club could buy players they would otherwise not have afforded.

5. In furtherance of those schemes, RFC chose to deliberately withhold the full details of their contractual arrangements with both players and managers from both the SFA and the SPL when submitting their applications to play under licence and in terms of the rules of both organisations.

6. In each of the years concerned, RFC had to apply for both domestic and European Licences to play football, and it is the granting of these licences which allows any football club to play in structured competition organised under the auspices of, or with the approval of, the SFA or UEFA.

7. Each and every licence application as submitted to the SFA in the knowledge that key financial and contractual information had been excluded in furtherance of tax avoidance purposes, and tax, which has since been declared to be legitimately due and payable from 1999 onwards, was unpaid and remains unpaid.

8. The above processes and procedures are no different, and indeed are considerably worse, breaches of article 5.1 under which Whyte was personally convicted and fined.

9. Further, as part of the HMRC investigations into the use of unlawful tax schemes, RFC deliberately lied to HMRC, SFA and SPL about the existence of side letters and other contractual documentation. This is particularly so in relation to the annual application for a playing licence.

On 20th May 2011, HMRC, in relation to one of the tax schemes, wrote to RFC and accused the club of “deliberate and fraudulent” behaviour in relation to the continued submission of false PAYE and NIC returns over a period of years.

10. It, therefore, follows that each and every application for a football licence made by RFC to the SFA from 2000 onwards (at least) was based on falsified financial, contractual and tax information and was designed to mislead the SFA with a view to persuading them to grant a licence on misrepresented grounds.

11. Not only is the above a breach of article 5.1 of the SFA handbook, but any licence obtained by misrepresentation has not been validly obtained as it has been obtained by way of false representation and deception.

12. It is a pre-requisite of entry into any league competition that the participating club holds a valid licence to play football.

13. In the event that a club did not or should not have held/hold a valid licence to play, that same club is not free to enter structured competition or register players to participate in such competition. It also follows that any declaration of a result of 0-3 in relation to any particular game as a result of a rule breach (such as fielding an ineligible player) is of no consequence because the club concerned was not eligible to participate at all.

14. The Court of Arbitration for Sport has already been invited by UEFA to hold that any application for a licence or any other compliance submission, which is devoid of all necessary financial and contractual information should be treated as null and void and as never having been received.

15. The same Court has also held that any title, championship, award, record, reward or other benefit which has been gained as a result of an improper or prohibited process should not be allowed to stand, the records of the award etc should be expunged and the sporting records corrected accordingly.

None of the above is dependent on a successful review of LNS but goes hand in hand with that process.

In the forthcoming review of Scottish Football recently announced by the SPFL, in conjunction with the SFA, all of the above should be under consideration.

LNS, under review, may determine that the players were in fact not eligible, but much more fundamental is the fact that there are clear facts and circumstances which should mean that the club itself was never eligible in terms of established legal jurisprudence.

As had been pointed out by Rod McKenzie, none of this has been considered by the SPFL as all matters concerning a licence are solely under the jurisdiction of the SFA.

Thus far, the SFA have taken no action against RFC or any of its officials as a result of the clubs involvement in, and cover up of, the Big Tax Case or the Wee Tax Case – both of which will be the subject of the forthcoming review demanded by Celtic and others.

541 COMMENTS


  1. More on BBC. I see they have welcomed back Daryl Broadfoot with open arms – he is on Sportsound as I write. He is of course the ex-SFA Communications Officer which in my view makes him damaged goods.

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  2. UPTHEHOOPSAUGUST 21, 2017 at 18:51

    Wasn’t sure who it was talking but then caught on it was Darryl. Seems to have spent the last ten minutes talking up the English Championship and talking down the Scottish domestic game.

    True to form for someone who has worked in the SFA. No imagination, no innovation, no encouragement, no vision on how to improve things.

    The championship is apparently competitive so that justifies Strachan picking guys who are dodgy at best and sometimes not even getting a regular game.

    Wondering, with the exception of Darren Fletcher, when he can recall the national team players from the lower EPL and Championship ever playing in Europe but Aberdeen guys like Shinnie continually get overlooked.

    As Tom English rightly asked, when exactly did the likes of Barry Bannan last do anything memorable in a Scottish jersey that justifies continual selection?

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  3. WOTTPIAUGUST 21, 2017 at 19:09  
    Wasn’t sure who it was talking but then caught on it was Darryl. Seems to have spent the last ten minutes talking up the English Championship and talking down the Scottish domestic game.
    True to form for someone who has worked in the SFA. No imagination, no innovation, no encouragement, no vision on how to improve things.
    The championship is apparently competitive so that justifies Strachan picking guys who are dodgy at best and sometimes not even getting a regular game.
    Wondering, with the exception of Darren Fletcher, when he can recall the national team players from the lower EPL and Championship ever playing in Europe but Aberdeen guys like Shinnie continually get overlooked.
    As Tom English rightly asked, when exactly did the likes of Barry Bannan last do anything memorable in a Scottish jersey that justifies continual selection?

    ================================

    I believe there was no limit on squad size so that makes it even more puzzling why guys like Shinnie and McGregor could not have been included for the experience.  You just can’t second guess Mr Strachan though.

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  4. Phil’s latest piece states that Pedro’s Ibrox future was discussed by the TRFC Board, and is at risk.

    But, even if they got rid of Pedro, what sort of manager would now apply for the job ?

    IMO, only a desperate and/or sentimental manager would apply for the TRFC role.
    At best, mibbees a promising young manager looking for a step up, before moving swiftly onto to a bigger club.
    [Pedro might have been motivated by desperation to exit Qatar ?] 

    i.e. TRFC would not be in a position of strength to secure their ideal / best option for manager.

    And any manager in the near future will have similar challenges to Pedro: no cash, free transfers, loans, and out of contract players will be the mainstay of the TRFC squad.

    Time will tell: Pedro might actually be doing a relatively decent job with the available resources ? 

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  5. Why is everyone under the impression the BBC are banned from Ibrox they are not, hence the highlights shown on sportscene and the right to analyse post match. Ladbrokes run the show and you are committed to them for the money they provide as sponsors and the running of the sport is the SFA.
    Over at Ibrox there is no commitment to give the BBC rights to their players for interviews and ladbrokes concern in this is of no big deal they get the exposure they desire. The BBC are quite happy with the setup as it suits both parties, the BBC can flannel away without having to ask awkard questions and can state they would if they were not banned and the Ibrox PR machine can fleece the gullible by not having to explain away awkard quaestions.
    This is why it is obvious English and McIntyre will not venture into the real world of journalism as they are comfy in the pretence that all is rosy whilst they line their pockets under the pretence of sports journalists, they are not.
    De Bor and Mols are squirrels to create fiction both have nothing to bring to the party they are footballers who participated in a fraud of the HMRC,and are big enough to understand liquidation and what that meant for the lie they pander too, they know the club they played for died they know this but are happy to go along for a song. Look at Mols involvement in the tribute act, part of Sons of Struth promoting youth football and helping to sell fake Lionbrand football strips whilst pretending they were boycotting Ashley and Puma, gies piece, Sons of Struth were part of the mickey mouse outfit that puts out statements, Club 1872.
    The whole SFA organisation are baw deeep in this and they know it is coming to a head, the cat has been let well and truly out the bag, they played the patsy for a fool and it turned out he was one holding all the cards, not guilty, they played the taxman for a fool expecting a CVA and walk away with a tidy wee profit from a scam, no CVA, SC appeal and bang guilty.
    Each case on its own has enough evidence on its own merit and this is what is developing into the death of either the SFA and SPFL muppets or the case against is going to a court based on evidence of which the statements made are from judges. This will not be turned around or leave room for spin the only evidence presented will be evidence from the courts guilty verdicts. Game over Regan and Doncaster, Dickson and Ogilivie public humiliation awaits.You have been caught out in the lie that was Souness and Smith and this blows a hole in the employment trust you cannot be payed for transfer activity and you cannot be payed by two employers what is it to be, bungs or dual contracts? 

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  6. bigboab1916  August 21, 2017 at 20:00

    I noticed that on Sunday’s Sportscene programme all the managers were interviewed immediately following the highlights of each game with the exception of one match – the one at Ibrox.  After the final whistle it cut straight to the BBC Scotland studio for the pundits to give their tuppence worth.

    If there is no BBC ban in force at the Govan club then the BBC Scotland controller should be taken to task for deciding  to exclude these two particular interviews.  Jon Daly of Hearts is not camera-shy and Pedro has been known to address his fans from a bush, so why deny the public the opportunity of hearing the strategy the respective managers employed in the match?

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  7. Billy BoyceAugust 21, 2017 at 20:32 
    If there is no BBC ban in force at the Govan club then the BBC Scotland controller should be taken to task for deciding to exclude these two particular interviews.

     The so called ban is a lie to suit the beeb and the PR guru traynor over by.

    Overwhelming evidence of a culture of corruption at Rangers 1998-2012 but Scotland’s football authorities and press are ignoring it.
    “An ongoing issue between the Ibrox club and the BBC prevents me asking him questions”(Chris MacLaughlin)

    Billy ask the BBC what the dispute is about,
    Ask why they can cosy up in studios and talk away its bullshit,the agenda is driven to steer away from the public real questions they dare not ask,
    English deflects back to tweets and uses the obsessed patter used by fans next it will be the hater bullshit.
    “You seem to tweet and retweet about Rangers all the time. Do you actually support a club? I can’t tell”
    it is in the BBC interest to steer clear of the story,they think fans button up the back, eevryone of them led with the 140 year history down the pan including the BBC jim traynor and all of them did a u turn, they realised the story, the truth, was of no interest to them financially they needed a myth they needed a job, so they can jog on Billy, the fix has been tippled to, no more back scratching piss, the truth, rangers were liquidated, they know it wont talk about it, and you cannot buy history and attach it to a new club.Ask Charles Greens QC.
    https://en-gb.facebook.com/YNRA2012Happened/posts/458925717646132
    The Myth of Continuity
    Alan Dewar QC, representing Charles Green at the Inner House of the Court of Session, has stated that ” The Rangers football club does not exist, it is an idea in people’s minds, a myth of continuity. No-one knows what the Rangers football club is, but it has no legal personality.”
    Mr Dewar adds that ” you can only be the chairman of an entity that has a legal personality. Sevco Scotland, and it alone, bought the assets and carried on the business. The concept of the Rangers Institution continuing exists only in the minds of die hard supporters.”

    BBC loaded questions and deflections to hand picked yes men, tell the fans the truth and stop hiding and showing favour.

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  8. BIGBOAB1916AUGUST 21, 2017 at 21:07
    “You seem to tweet and retweet about Rangers all the time. Do you actually support a club? I can’t tell”
    ————————–
    I think that tweet was directed at me after i asked Replying to @BBCTomEnglish @craigie69 and 2 others What ex rangers player do you have lined up for the next interview? asking for a friend.
    ————
    Replying to @ClusterOne2 @craigie69 and 2 others You seem to tweet and retweet about Rangers all the time. Do you actually support a club? I can’t tell
    ———————————-
    I did laugh

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  9. I know earlier I was moaning about Strachan not picking Scots based players but just realised he has Steven Whittaker in his squad.

    Just watch how slow and ineffective he was at Hamilton’s third goal at the weekend. Not saying the goal wouldn’t have been scored given Hamiltons movement and passing but watch how slow and lumbering SW is when tracking back and not putting in any effort when the ball was played through the gap by Docherty.

    Another player that should now be giving way to younger players at International level to prepare for the future.

    Fair play to him as I am sure SW will turn up and do what he can for the cause but it is the manager’s at fault for his excessive loyalty to auld timers and under performers.

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  10. A quote from the DR online discussion of UEFA co-efficients. 
    “Rangers, Hearts and Hibs are all handicapped in the rankings by spending time outside Scotland’s top division.”
    Whilst the above may be true re Hearts and Hibs it doesn’t quite explain why Rangers are ranked so lowly by UEFA. Nice wee bit of obfuscation there boys. And I’m pretty sure that newspaper is banned from Ibrox is it not?.

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  11. We can laugh about the BBC interview parade of EBT recipients. I’ve heard it suggested that perhaps they should have the letters added to their name; Barry Ferguson EBT, Alastair McCoist OBE EBT and such like😊
    However there is a serious point. These guys are not guilty of the corporate fraud perpetrated by their employers. Consequently they get a pass when it comes to accusations of cheating at football. But that is no reason to forget that what they did was knowingly participate in a scam to avoid paying tax on their earnings, despite those earnings being upwards of 50 times the national average salary.
    Of course that is not only a Rangers issue, but it speaks to the reality that Fat Cat culture is now football culture nowadays.
    In the 60s and 70s, football was notably less expensive an entertainment than the pictures. Was cheaper to get into Ibrox than the Odeon. Those differentials are now gone, gobbled up by greed and avarice on the part of both those on and off the field.
    Just a thought. Beer inflation since 1970 is at around 2000%
    Football inflation is running at more than four times that amount – 8000%. !
    And still the fans fork out in world-leading numbers. In return, they are fed a diet of, by and large, mediocrity and underachievement.

    Modern players can’t be tagged with character defects just because they aren’t as skilful or successful as their 60s/70s counterparts, but they’ve got a cheek the height of a Ronnie McKinnon clearance to be demanding “Netto!” during pay talks whilst diving up the nearest close when Hector does his rounds.

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  12. I’m not sure if this is the same David Whitehouse as the D&P guy, but there is a case being called at the CoS today. Unfortunately I can’t make it today.
     David Whitehouse, 35c Bollin Hill, Wilmslow, Cheshire AG The Right Hon James Wolffe QC, Lord Advocate, Crown Office, 25 Chambers Street, Edinburgh.  A & W M Urquhart

    If JJ is looking in, then the Court of Session remains in its summer recess until 25 September this year. The change to the court term dates and recesses doesn’t kick in before then.

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  13. I was travelling recently, for a couple of months, with a lady wheel chair user and it fairly opens your eyes. It demonstrated to me the crucial benefit of disabled parking, ramps and lifts, doors etc. To be fair she is very independent and needed very little help, if any, I only did the courteous things I would normally do.  Opening doors, carry things.

    I was watching the game at Celtic Park last week and it was pouring.  I noticed all the wheel chair users at the front of what I think was the north stand and they were getting soaked.  All around the 3 stands I could see, fans had left the front rows empty and taken up vacant seats further up the stands.

    Manchester Utd. have announced that they are relocating 2,600 season ticket holders in order to accommodate another 300 disabled supporters.  On the stadium diagram proposals, it looks as if many seats (spaces?) for disabled fans will be further up the stands.  They also have a way for wheel chair users to have their family/ friends beside them.  To be honest, I don’t know the ins and outs of it.

    I don’t know the disabled experience for fans around Scottish football.  But I would hope that, at the very least, a way can be found to shelter them from the worst of the elements once they are in the ground.

    Another argument for sharing out the pot of gold for the good of all?

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  14. Interview in the Guardian today with Eni Aluko about the way the English FA dealt with her complaint.

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/aug/21/eni-aluko-interview-race-difficult-situation

    It contains the following, which put me in mind of another FA’s approach to the mechanics of rigorous investigation (my use of bold text and terms in square brackets).

    ‘…seeing a lot of half-truths, a lot of misrepresentations and a lot of insinuations…’
    ‘How could I trust the process if the FA couldn’t be bothered to speak to the key people?’
    ‘The findings don’t explain why certain people…weren’t spoken to. Yet the FA would like us to take it as an unequivocal conclusion. People weren’t spoken to under oath. People weren’t cross-examined. It’s not a high court judge. It’s a paid barrister’s opinion, based on half the evidence, without speaking to key witnesses – yet speaking to [people] who have a vested interest…I believe those [people] are terrified to speak out. They are not going to speak out and…I wouldn’t either in their position.’
    ‘I empathise with the barrister, if I’m honest. I believe she was deliberately chosen… Her name has been plastered everywhere. I believe she has been given only half the information.’
    ‘The FA…had ignored key evidence so that’s why my lawyers wrote to them saying: ‘This is not a genuine search for the truth’

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  15. TRISIDIUMAUGUST 22, 2017 at 02:14
    These guys are not guilty of the corporate fraud perpetrated by their employers. Consequently they get a pass when it comes to accusations of cheating at football. But that is no reason to forget that what they did was knowingly participate in a scam to avoid paying tax on their earnings, despite those earnings being upwards of 50 times the national average salary.
    —————
    So far i believe it has only been Michael Mols £260,000 EBT  who has put the blame at murrays door.
    https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1385360/rangers-michael-mols-blames-sir-david-murray-financial-collapse/

    The former Gers striker pins the blame for the Ibrox side’s financial collapse on ex-owner Sir David Murray.
    ———-
    Fair enough you may say, but there is always a but.
    ——-
    MICHAEL MOLS has claimed Rangers’ liquidation ‘killed Scottish football’.
    He is adamant that talk of stripping titles is a waste of time, but didn’t hold back on former Ibrox money-man Murray.
    Mols said: “I think he knew what he was doing.
    “It’s hard to put the club in that situation. I wouldn’t do that.
    “It affected so many people who are following Rangers and you’ve seen the results, four leagues down. It affected the whole of Scottish football.
    “Yeah, I would blame him or his advisors.
    —————-
    He knows Murray and the ibrox club did wrong but refuses title stripping and states liquidation ‘killed Scottish football’He also states 
    Mols said: “I think he knew (Murray)what he was doing.
    “It’s hard to put the club in that situation. I wouldn’t do that.
    ———
    But yet you did Mr Moles by accepting an EBT Also Rangers’ liquidation did not ‘killed Scottish football’. it killed rangers.They may get a pass when it comes to accusations of cheating at football but they don’t get a pass for accepting that the club they played for is dead and should be punished.It not only affected so many people who are following Rangers Mr Moles it affected so many more people what rangers did.
    It is the refusual from the EBT players to acknowledge the wrongs of the ibrox club and that liquidation killed rangers no one else, that the ex EBT rangers players should be no where near an interview with anyone until they are to get off message and tell the truth.
    Yes We can laugh about the BBC interview parade of EBT recipients.But not at my expense

    Anyway back to the DIY, day off. Hope i kind of put that post in a way you can understand

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  16. So it might seem Jimbo!

    Also, good point, about facilities for football fans in wheelchairs. All it takes is for the fittest and ablest of us to break a leg to suddenly find ourselves ‘disabled’ and discover just how many barriers there are to doing everyday things. Let’s hope clubs can be more accommodating, and that any new stands that are built make appropriate allowance.

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  17. People are also living longer and the use of mobility aids is increasing hugely.  You only have to see it in shopping centres, these are people who a generation ago would have been house bound.

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  18. Trisidium
    August 22, 2017 at 02:14
     
    “Beer inflation and football inflation”  brilliant. 10
    —————————————————————–
    That took me right back to 1964 when one of my pals used to express the cost of
    things in terms of,  seven inch 45 RPM vinyl records “singles” which were then, 
    6s 8d each,  so 10 shillings was 1 and a half  singles,  £1 was “3 singles” and so on.
     

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  19. EASYJAMBOAUGUST 22, 2017 at 13:47  I see that Supporters Direct have issued the results of their annual survey today.
    https://stv.tv/sport/football/1396165-scottish-football-fans-arent-getting-value-for-money/
    It will be interesting to see how the findings compare with those of the SFSA.
    ———————————————————————————————-
    Everything about the SFSA Survey is quite different EJ.
    It all fits in with the old adage of “He who pays the piper calls the tune”.

    The main differences in approach would be

    – It wasn’t funded by money from the governing bodies and the Westminister Government.

    – It isn’t a Scottish variant of a national establishment activity and is actually a development of an academicaly linked fan based survey coming out of Germany where fans have a real voice, and are listened to.

    – It asked questions that both the SFA and SFPL might not have wanted people to ask, and will maybe even give answers that they might not want to hear.

    – It is still open – I think till the end of the month and is already bigger significantly which is amazing given the disparity in resources.

    – Its findings will not be pre-reviewed and soundbited by Messrs Doncaster, Regan and their PR machinery.

    – As I said quite different and I look forward to seeing just what fans will say when they get asked about real questions.

    If you are reading this and haven’t filled it in then please do so.

    Took me 5 minutes.

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  20. Finloch August 22, 2017 at 14:22
    ————————-
    The SFSA survey finished yesterday with 16,324 submissions.

    A newsletter is due to be issued with the timeline for future plans either later today or tomorrow

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  21. He (Doncaster) added: “Tackling unacceptable conduct also remains at the forefront of our minds and earlier this year we strengthened our guidance to our members, with the clubs now accepting more responsibility in Scottish Cup matches to investigate and impose sanctions on those who have misbehaved at our games.”

    I mean really where do you start?

    “Tackling unacceptable conduct also remains at the forefront of our minds”
    So, The Celtic Captain is confronted by a moron on the pitch,  a Celtic player is racially abused, objects are thrown at Celtic players.  And yet, not a peep from Doncaster or Regan. Forefront of your mind? A joke!

    “Earlier this year we strengthened our GUIDANCE to our members”
    This is not the time for guidance, this is the time for rules to be adhered to and meaningful sanctions employed.  The offensive behaviour act is a joke.  Ineffective..  Sectarian singing should be policed by the Scottish football authorities, the Police Service of Scotland can’t.  Points deductions is the only answer regardless of the club.  That will soon shut them up.

    “Scottish cup matches” 
    Why single that tourney out for attention?  Every single game played in Scotland should be under the microscope.

    If we had a governing body who had vision, determination and integrity, this embarrassment to Scottish football (sectarianism especially) could be eradicated a lot quicker than they realise.  Don’t wait for the wider society, take the lead with football.

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  22. EASYJAMBO
    AUGUST 22, 2017 at 13:47 
    I see that Supporters Direct have issued the results of their annual survey today.
    https://stv.tv/sport/football/1396165-scottish-football-fans-arent-getting-value-for-money/
    It will be interesting to see how the findings compare with those of the SFSA.
    ===========================
    Indeed, EJ!

    Extracted from the SD survey;

    “Value for money considered, “the biggest threat to the future of the game in the next five years”…”

    Really?!

    And this from the Hampden bunker;

    “Stewart Regan, Chief Executive at the Scottish FA, said:
    “This is an important survey for us and we use the findings to help us understand the issues affecting Scottish football and to review and measure fans’ attitudes from year to year…”
    &
    SPFL Chief Executive Neil Doncaster welcomed the input of supporters, saying:
    “The Scottish Football Supporters Survey is a very valuable, annual barometer of the issues most important to fans across the country. 

    If they are both ‘so keen’ to find out about fans’ opinions now… then they will both welcome the added feedback provided by the SFSA survey from a significant total of 16K supporters ?
    [And this is 2K larger response than the SD survey.]

    The SD survey is a feeble diversionary tactic supported by the SFA & SPFL.  20

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  23. CLUSTER ONEAUGUST 22, 2017 at 15:39

    And I bet there’s a fair bit of “working from home” as well. 
    Oh it’s good to be retired. 
    Mon the hoops. 

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  24. Jimbo
    Some disabled folk categorise folk into two classes – disabled and tab. Tab is an acronym for “temporarily able bodied” on the logic that something comes to us all over time.
    The growing lack of empathy and civility in society is demonstrated by the increasing unpleasantness visited upon those who are disabled and this is worse for those whose disability is invisible “ye canny be blind ye look alright to me”. 
    There was a discussion recently on one of the TRFC forums about improving facilities for disabled people it was very unempathetic
    All you wage slaves back to work no time for the retired to attend to other matters

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  25. You’ve already seen some of the stuff on the Supporters Direct survey.
    Here is the press release from the marketing agency who are managing us.
    It comes complete with quotes from Regan and Doncaster and others so no journo has the inconvenience of thinking up questions or phoning them for a wee chat.

    We are all being coralled and kettled.

    They are cynically making the lead headline about value for money which makes us all look at our clubs first and the SFA and SFPL second.

    I’d say that is a bit on the outrageous side.

    Enjoy and then compare who actually writes anything when you see it reported in tonights and tomorrows news

    Scottish Football Supporters Survey 2017 results revealed by Supporters Direct Scotland
    DATE: TUESDAY 22 AUGUST 2017
    Key headlines:
    Value for money considered, “the biggest threat to the future of the game in the next five years”Nearly 14,000 submissions to 2017 survey, in partnership with Scottish FA & SPFLResults presented to Scottish FA’s Professional Game Board, disseminated to all 42 pro clubsGoverning bodies have committed to listening and engaging with supportersTicket pricing, kick off times and the relationship fans have with their clubs considered to be the three most important factors in decision to attend a gameFans don’t believe Scottish football is committed to a high-quality fan experience (over 55% either disagree or strongly disagree)   
    Supporters Direct Scotland (SD Scotland) today reveals results of its 2017 Scottish Football Supporters Survey, in partnership with the Scottish FA and the SPFL.
    Amongst the key headlines from this year’s consultation, which engaged around 14,000 fans via almost every club in Scotland, are that supporters do not believe the admission price for games in Scotland represents value for money. “Your relationship with your club,” ranked third as a determinate around whether supporters would attend matches. And over 50% of supporters believe there should be more resources given to tackle and stamp out forms of unacceptable conduct, but there was not majority support for “strict liability”. A large majority (71%) were opposed to the Offensive Behaviour Act (OBA). SD Scotland has set out three core “asks” to football’s governing bodies in Scotland as a result of the findings namely: 
    ASKOUTCOMEChallenge clubs and the Scottish FA to examine how they improve the value for money including within ticket pricesSD Scotland to organise a national event for clubs on the issue of ticket pricing and the matchday experienceClubs to think best how they can further involve and engage fans within the governance and ownership of clubs, whether this be through “structured dialogue” or fan representation.SD Scotland to publish document around “structured dialogue” and how best clubs can engage with their supportersThat the Scottish Government review legislation that aims to curb unacceptable conduct, and that more resources are committed by stakeholders towards tackling unacceptable conductSD Scotland to facilitate a supporter led event on how best to tackle issues of unacceptable conduct with SPFL & Scottish FA involvement. The majority of Scottish fans believe the admission price for games in Scotland is either ‘very poor’ or ‘poor’ value for money according to the survey. Although this is the most significant concern for supporters, the number who considered value for money poor or very poor has reduced by 14% year on year. The issue of value for money is a theme throughout supporter responses with fans considering affordability of the game to be the biggest threat to the future of the game. and 55% of fans disagreeing with the idea that Scottish football is committed to a high-quality fan experience. Interestingly, 75% of supporters say that they don’t base their decisions on attending matches around live TV selections. Although 56% believe Scottish football doesn’t reflect good value for money, positively that statistic has dropped 5% from last year. Officially recognised as the lead supporters group in Scotland by the Scottish Professional Football League (SPFL) and the Scottish Football Association (Scottish FA), Supporters Direct Scotland has established a formal means to engage with the game’s key decision makers and represent fans’ views. This is achieved through the organisation’s place on the Scottish FA Congress as Supporter Representatives. Findings of this year’s survey have also been presented or shared with:
    Scottish FA’s Professional Game BoardSupporter Liaison Officer Network in ScotlandAll 42 SPFL clubsPolice ScotlandMinister for Sport & Mental HealthThe Scottish Government’s civil serviceOther key themes to arise from the survey include the supporter experience and fans’ involvement and relationship with their clubs.
    A majority of supporters do not want strict liability or were unsure about it (52%)Over 81% of fans think Scottish football has an issue with sectarianism50% of fans have been subjected to sectarianism in and around football stadia in Scotland18% of participants feel they’ve been subjected to physical abuse in and around Scottish football stadia71% of fans don’t believe the Offensive Behaviour Act (OBA) has been effective in preventing unacceptable conduct by supportersFans feel they should have partial ownership (including board representation) in their clubs over any other level of involvement – 63%88% of fans are in favour of safe standingDisabled fans think their club provide adequate facilities for disabled fansThe survey results come a time of significant change for Supporters Direct Scotland who will become an independent organisation from December 2017. Supporters Direct Scotland will also establish a new charity foundation to support ongoing work to promote community engagement. Head of Supporters Direct Scotland Andrew Jenkin says: “What we are seeing now is a really clear demand from supporters to see greater value for money around football. Supporters Direct Scotland appreciates the extremely challenging balance that our clubs face, and we want to support them. Addressing value for money might include looking at more pricing variation, and ways of delivering added value. Attendances are by-and-large an improving picture, but it’s absolutely critical we future-proof Scottish football by being on the front foot. “Once again, supporters also tell us they want to be engaged by their clubs. The relationship a supporter has with a club has a direct impact on their decision to attend games or spend money. That means there is a role for clubs to think really carefully about how they reflect the values of their club, not the other way around. To reflect the values of your supporters you need to know and talk to them, and we hope our forthcoming new guide on Structured Dialogue can be effective in providing examples of best practice. “Supporter experience is not rated highly, and part of that is dictated to by fan behaviour. Supporters continue to tell us there is a problem, and now there’s a real moving sense that the Offensive Behaviour Act, for its broad promises has delivered little. So we have a problem, but not the sort of solution that is necessary. In order to positively influence the future agenda here, we are asking the SPFL and the Scottish FA to work with us to deliver a supporter-led event on how we can bring about a change in culture needed to ensure that our grounds are bouncing with enthusiasm, but not unnecessarily aggressive. “We’re making these asks to Scottish football at a time when as an organisation we are making a genuine difference to the game in this country. Our Supporter Liaison Programme in partnership with the Scottish FA and supported by UEFA is providing training and development to the increasing number of SLOs across the country. “Our Club Development Scotland project has seen us work with a number of professional and community clubs providing financial, legal and practical advice around developing sustainable community led business models. “Colours of our Scarves, remains our flagship community programme promoting tolerance and equality in schools across the country. “We have also recently secured funding to explore the setting up of a “Fans Bank” or community fund, which would allow for Supporters Direct Scotland to potentially set up a social investment loan facility for clubs at all levels of the game to use the resource for social benefit. The funding from the Paul Hamlyn Foundation will be used to research, analyse and develop a robust model for the future. “Supporters can play a significant role in securing the brightest future for Scottish football. Our commitment is to work with those who govern the game – and the country – to ensure that the voice of supporters is heard, and acted upon.” 

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  26. Part 2 

     
    Stewart Regan, Chief Executive at the Scottish FA, said: “This is an important survey for us and we use the findings to help us understand the issues affecting Scottish football and to review and measure fans’ attitudes from year to year. “Supporters Direct Scotland are part of our Congress and have a voice on that platform alongside club representatives, PFA Scotland, the media and other league and affiliate members. We will consider these findings within Congress and will also focus on some of the topics at our annual Convention. Our aim will be to share good practice and spark discussion around how Scottish football can do more to deliver value for money to supporters. “This is an area that we are working on with our Scotland Supporters Club. This campaign we’ve invested in a shuttle bus service to help supporters get to and from Hampden for Scotland international matches and we have also introduced fan zones at our home games. On top of this, we are in the middle of a separate research project looking at ways to improve the Scotland Supporters Club package. We’ve had 3,000 responses to our call for feedback which will help us shape the offer in the future. “Tackling unacceptable conduct also remains at the forefront of our minds and earlier this year we strengthened our guidance to our members with the clubs now accepting more responsibility in Scottish Cup matches to investigate and impose sanctions on those who have misbehaved at our games.” SPFL Chief Executive Neil Doncaster welcomed the input of supporters, saying: “The Scottish Football Supporters Survey is a very valuable, annual barometer of the issues most important to fans across the country. We thank each and every fan who took the time to complete the survey which again shows just how much Scottish football supporters care about the game.  “The SPFL recognises that value for money and ticket pricing are, and arguably always will be, top priorities for supporters while also acknowledging the considerable work clubs commit to in this area, which was an ‘ask’ of last year’s survey. Indeed a 14% reduction in those who deem ‘value for money’ as being poor or very poor is evidence that clubs are making some progress on this front. On pricing specifically, the most recent BBC Price of Football survey again provided considerable evidence of ticket prices either being frozen or reduced across all leagues, with the average price of the cheapest season ticket across all 12 Ladbrokes Premiership clubs down. Further, the SPFL’s own research last November revealed that the vast majority of clubs provide free tickets for community groups, charitable causes and others who would find it otherwise challenging to attend a game, with an estimated 84,000 given away in the season before last. There is always more work that can be done and we welcome the input of SD Scotland, working with the SPFL and Scottish FA, to proactively examine and identify further innovations in pricing as well as new ideas around value for money and added value which could be put forward for consideration by clubs. “On the subject of Unacceptable Conduct, we continue to work closely with Scottish Government, Scottish FA and our clubs. In January of this year the SPFL published updated and newly approved League-wide guidance on Unacceptable Conduct, applicable to all 42 member clubs. Recently, we also agreed to collate and share information with both the Scottish Government and Police Scotland regarding incidents of Unacceptable Conduct at SPFL matches at regular intervals throughout the current Scottish football season. This demonstrates the SPFL’s commitment to curbing Unacceptable Conduct in our stadia and we continue to work with the Scottish Government on this matter. It is important we all continue to work together to help make Scottish football as safe and welcoming an environment for fans as possible. “While the purpose of the survey is to identify areas for improvement, it is also worth highlighting some of Scottish football’s success stories, investments and opportunities, both recent and current. That 63% of supporters are in favour of the new format of the Betfred Cup is a real vindication of the brave decision of clubs to shake up the format – with the return to a pre-Christmas final particularly popular – and is reflected in a significantly enhanced live broadcast deal and record payouts to clubs competing. There has been major investment and innovation at some of our biggest clubs’ stadia to enhance matchday experience for supporters, Celtic Park’s safe standing area (the first in the UK) and the new Tynecastle Park main stand development being two great examples. Further, Aberdeen FC is presently campaigning for support for a new stadium development, which would be the biggest seen in this country for many years and includes supporter-friendly facilities such as a dedicated fan zone, community pavilion, museum, café and bar. Investment in current and new stadia, at all levels, can only further improve the quality of experience for fans of all ages. “We all share a common goal of wishing Scottish football to be in the very best health possible, both on the pitch and off it, for the benefit of supporters, players and all involved at our 42 clubs. Supporters Direct Scotland has an important role to play in representing the view of fans across Scotland and we look forward to working with Andrew Jenkin and his team to identify ways to further enhance the game for supporters in the year ahead.” ENDS For more information please contact:Andrew Jenkin, Head of SD Scotlandandrew.jenkin@supporters-direct.org / 07769 175 480 About SD Scotland
    SD Scotland help fans to set up democratic cooperatives to gain influence in the running and ownership of their clubs.SD and SD Scotland represent over 200 supporters’ trusts and similar organisations in England, Scotland and across Europe, with over 750,000 members.SD Scotland’s activities include running the Scottish Supporters Network, representing supporters on a wider scale within the Governance structures of Scottish football, assisting clubs with the Supporter Liaison Officer role, Colours of our Scarves, their equality in sport programme and Club Development Scotland, their consultancy service helping to facilitate community ownership of clubs and their growth.SD Scotland are the Supporter Representative body on the Scottish FA Congress
    Find out more http://www.supporters-direct.scotTwitter: @SuppDirectScot

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  27. To appease some in the SMSM…

    CFC should do the right thing, and politely decline being included in the CL group stage draw.

    If this club – with its renowned social conscience – has any consideration for Scottish football at all, it should walk away from the obscene riches of the CL.
    And their young players simply don’t need to be exposed to glamour ties against the best clubs – and best players – on the planet.

    Yes, we should listen to the SMSM, and urge CFC to do what’s best for Scottish football!  15
    Oh, and let’s all just ‘move on’ as well for the good of the game.

    222222

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  28. Honestly, I have no nails left.  After going in 1-1 at half time I felt ok to go and do the dishes.  Then this and that.  Next thing my nephew is on the phone uncle Jim whit happened?  He was out working in the garage.  I came back into the living room, 4-1!!!
    The rest as they say is history.  It’s not easy supporting Celtic.

    I can’t believe it’s a year since the draw for the group stages.  I was sitting in the pub with a pal, and as the draw progressed I was saying to my pal no, no, no not Barcelona again.  But yes the group of death.  The Pope’s 11? don’t make me laugh, we are cursed.

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  29. jimboAugust 22, 2017 at 20:43
    It’s not easy supporting Celtic.
    —————————————————————————-
    You try supporting us Jimbo boy!

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  30.  I today received a reply ,from Mr Doncaster, on behalf of the new Chairman of the SPFL ( Mr MacLennan) to my letter of 12th July.(Mannerly of  Mr MacLennan to reply, doubly so if I did actually address him in my letter, as well as on the envelope,by the wrong name!)

    He encloses the SPFL’s media statement of 26th July, which contains  the written advice from Senior Counsel Gerry Moynihan Q.C., and the the SPFL’s support for the calls which  have been made for an independent review.

    We’ve all seen those already, so there’s nothing new.

    I will acknowledge receipt of the reply.

    And I will include in my reply a contradiction of what was put as a statement of fact in Question 4.2 of the list of questions on which the QC was asked to advise, namely, the statement that “in the case of Rangers FC, it was a member the of the SPL and it was owned and operated by Oldco until Rangerc FC became owned and operated by Newco”.

    I will remind him that there was never a  ‘holding club’ owning and operating Rangers FC of 1899. The only entity incorporated under that name was  the club founded on Glasgow Green.

    And it was  the club ( that very incorporated Rangers FC) that in 2012 lost its entitlement to a share in what by then had become the SPL by suffering the Insolvency Event of Liquidation: in consequence of which it ceased to be entitled to membership of the SFA, and ceased thereby to be a recognised professional football club in Scotland.

    It was not sold to a new ‘owner and operator’

    Some but not all of the assets of the football club were bought by an individual/consortium.

    This individual/consortium then set up a new club which had to apply for the first time for league membership.

    Only when that membership was granted ( finally, and with many objections) did it become entitled to membership  of the SFA.

    And it was much later before the new club, bearing its own brand new Companies House number was purchased by a ‘holding company’-which has its own Companies House number
    The holding company that is Rangers International Football Club plc is the parent company NOT of the Rangers FC of 1872/99, but of  SevcoScotland Ltd of 2012, renamed as The Rangers Football Club Ltd.

    And I shall add that the deceitful use of ‘Rangers FC’ to imply that two quite different entities are one and the same has been and remains  a hallmark of the deceitful and dishonest approach brought to the business of dealing with the most dreadful episode of sustained football cheating that Scotland has ever seen .

    I will assert that as long as that deceit lies at the heart of Scottish Football governance, Scottish Football will deserve to be regarded as no more than a shady , shabby and unsavoury business to be involved in.

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  31. Me yesterday:
    “As for the likes of Campbell Ogilvie and Andrew Dickson et.al. why are they not treated as persona non grata?  Not yet exposed, officially, for any wrong doing but would any self respecting business or governing body want anything to do with them, even if it only for the corporate smell?”

    ‘Self respecting governing body’

    You today:
    “I will assert that as long as that deceit lies at the heart of Scottish Football governance, Scottish Football will deserve to be regarded as no more than a shady , shabby and unsavoury business to be involved in.”

    I think you have answered my question.

    They deserve each other.

    It will end in tears.

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  32. Unconnectedly with my immediately previous post, I note* that Barclays bank has taken over as the sole banker for Murray Capital’s (yes, that SDM) day-to-day requirements following a Lloyds-owned Bank of Scotland relationship.

    SDM’s son, David DM, said ” The new banking arrangement with Barclays…….allows us more flexibility in our finances..’

    By geez, Barclays must be made of rubber if it can be more flexible than HBOS was!

    Should I move my account, I wonder?18
    * From today’s ‘Scotsman’, print edition, page 35.

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  33. JOHN CLARKAUGUST 22, 2017 at 21:20
    Put like that John, it’s really pretty straightforward! I think this captures it in the proverbial nutshell (no squirrels here). Why then do our media find it so hard to get their head around this? Why do the. BBC think that its audience is too thick to understand and therefore they must simplify the message to “there’ll always be a Rangers.” Why do folk like Jim Whyte on Talk Sport avoid the issue by saying stuff like, ‘I really don’t understand it.” Well it’s really pretty straightforward, Jim, as JC has just proven.

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  34. While reading JC’s post I got to thinking, again, of the continuity myth (thanks John03, just what I needed) and came to realise that the Loch Ness Monster 20 (OK that’s a squirrel, but it’s the nearest we’ve got to a monster, so use your bloody imagination) had been mentioned, with some supporting evidence15 (maybe photos of a squirrel, by the loch, cunningly caught out of proportion) more often than the ‘club separate from the company’ thingy ever was prior to the club’s insolvency – by a ratio of, something like, 10 million to none, zero, zilch!

    Now, it seems to me, that the ‘continuation myth’ is not much different from the Loch Ness Monster one, in that it’s propagated by people just as desperate to believe in it, or to have other people believe in it, while knowing it doesn’t stand up to any intelligent examination by a mind not soaked in that brown liquid that’s distilled not far from the loch.

    As I’ve said before, I continually find it impossible to find a way of referencing whatever it is that they (the myth propagators) see the ‘thingy’ as – so I’m not going rack my brains, anymore, trying to find something to call it, I’m just going to call it a ‘Nessie’ from now on, because, while one mythical object might live in/under water, neither mythical entity actually holds any water, none at all, not one little drop!

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  35.  FinlochAugust 22, 2017 at 16:47
    ‘..You’ve already seen some of the stuff on the Supporters Direct survey……..Here is the press release from the marketing agency who are managing us.It comes complete with quotes from Regan and Doncaster
    They are cynically making the lead headline about value for money which makes us all look at our clubs first and the SFA and SFPL second.
    I’d say that is a bit on the outrageous side…’
    __________
    And you will not be alone, Finloch, in saying so.(And thanks for posting that material)

    Both cheeks of the arse of Scottish football Governance will, I think, get  skelped  when the Scottish Football Supporters Association’ , wholly independent , unsponsored by and not in any way under the control of the SFA/SPFL , with some 16000+ responses , produces its academically rigorous analysis of its survey.

    The ‘match-day’ experience can be improved to the nth degree, even,all things being equal,  to the equivalent of the wonderfully high standards of the cinema-going experience in,say, the ‘Dominion’ in Edinburgh ( there are other cinemas and cinema complexes!), but if you believe that ‘football competition’ is rigged, that the childhood cry that ‘cheats never win’ is unsoundly based in the context of Scottish Football, then the best ‘match-day’ experience turns to ashes in the mouth.

    All of us, bar none ,on this blog, have journeyed ,stood or sat cold, wet, paying over the odds for ‘pies’ and less-than-nectarian ( yes, that’s an ‘n’ ) beverages as part of our match-day experience.

    We did it it cheerfully enough, because we thought (in so far as we thought about it at all) that the games we watched were essentially true sporting events: generally, on the day, the players played ,luck, skill, and the occasional honest mistake,determined the outcome, more or less honestly- no drug-taking, no match-fixing, no selling of the jersey, no ‘nothing’ of the kind of troubles that bedevil other sports.

    And then we find that our Football authorities are as they are!

    And that our clubs are as they are when faced with having to stand up for sporting integrity!

    Who now is going to spend money even on the most luxurious ‘match-day experience’?

    Our Football Authorities are so perversely blind that they cannot, will not, see and understand the truth of what they have allowed to happen- the ( at this point in time)  triumph of Cheating over Integrity.

    Fiddling about with questions of how the clubs are to enhance the ‘match-day experience’ is, as you rightly say, Finloch, a cynical continuance of denial of the real problem:their own fundamental cheatery.

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  36. AllyjamboAugust 22, 2017 at 22:49
    ‘..While reading JC’s post I got to thinking, again, of the continuity myth (thanks John , just what I needed)’
    __________
    Your post  with the wee squirrell doubling as the Loch Ness Monster  made me smile!19
    But it also made me reflect on what a poster on this blog whose name now I can’t remember ( it was some years ago) said in the context of repetition being necessary because different, and new, people had to be informed.
    He reminded us of the Roman senator Cato whose political savvy was sharp enough to see where others couldn’t or wouldn’t see it, the danger, over years, that Carthage presented, and who ( it seems) ended every speech in the Senate with the words “Delenda est Carthago”- Carthage must be destroyed.
    He did so, to make sure that every ‘new boy’ Senator, and any Quisling or Chamberlain-like ‘appeasers’ were aware that there was at stake a matter fundamental to the continuing safety and welfare of the Roman republic’s existence.
    I think we can assume that the readership of this blog shifts and changes over time, and also that the blog is read by the occasional journalist and, perhaps, by lowly persons employed by the SFA and SPFL, maybe even occasionally by persons furth of Scotland.
    I am no Cato, of course, but I am conscious that new readers of the blog might be unaware of the basic facts; and that the propagandists of untruth might capitalise on that unawareness.
    Hence my fairly repetitious posts on the reasons why TRFC Ltd cannot possibly be the Rangers that my boyhood neighbours and fellow-street-footballers in the 1949s/1950s supported.
    Today what must be destroyed is not Carthage, but the deceit at the heart of Scottish Football.
    Sadly, I cannot put that into Latin!
    ( Would the ‘Cato’ poster care to remind me when he first posted the ‘Cato’ reference?)
     

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  37. John ClarkAugust 22, 2017 at 23:51
    “Today what must be destroyed is not Carthage, but the deceit at the heart of Scottish Football.”
    Quae hodie est, non potest destrui Carthaginem sed dolo ab Scottish Football ad Cor.
    Hail Hail

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  38. bigboab1916August 23, 2017 at 00:26
    ‘..Quae hodie est,…’
    _________
    Absolutely brilliant response! 
    I’m not scholar enough to be entirely sure that a Latinist might give you 10 out of 10 for grammatical accuracy, tamen
    Ave ave!

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  39. John Clark
    You might want to add to your reply that as revealed on here by Hirsute Pursute and extended by Easy Jambo there was no owner/operator construct in SPL rules until 2005. Before then there was only a club.
    Thus the QC is wrong to give the impression a construction of separation of  club from owner operator existed since 1872.
    As pointed out by H the earliest that construction could apply would be from 2005 but since the rule change was never introduced for that meaning to be applied then its application in that way is therefore questionable.
    You could also point out that UEFA don’t accept an abstract construct of operatimg or holding company in their rules in whilst recognising that a club can be operated by by a company.
    Such a construct must have a written agreement in place and if a company operating a club goes bust then to UEFA the club operating under such an arrangement loses its continuing membership of a national association.
    This is of course contained in the Traverso letter and is based on Art12 of UEFA FFP designed to protect the sporting integrity of UEFA competitions, something the SPFL seem to have overlooked.
    You might even ask Doncaster if UEFA were ever consulted by the SPFL or SFA in the process of crafting the 5 Way to ensure it did not conflict with UEFA regulations.
    I’ll e mail you the details.

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  40. FinlochAugust 22, 2017 at 16:47

    ‘Value for money considered, “the biggest threat to the future of the game in the next five years”Nearly 14,000 submissions to 2017 survey, in partnership with Scottish FA & SPFLResults presented to Scottish FA’s Professional Game Board, disseminated to all 42 pro clubsGoverning bodies have committed to listening and engaging with supportersTicket pricing, kick off times and the relationship fans have with their clubs considered to be the three most important factors in decision to attend a gameFans don’t believe Scottish football is committed to a high-quality fan experience (over 55% either disagree or strongly disagree)   Supporters Direct Scotland (SD Scotland) today reveals results of its 2017 Scottish Football Supporters Survey, in partnership with the Scottish FA and the SPFL.’
    ___________

    Thank you, Finloch, for posting that, it is not your fault that it is a load of keech! 

    The idea that ‘value for money’ is something that greatly bothers football supporters is risible, for if it did, then an awful lot more would have been lost to the game than have to date.

    The evidence is there for all to see, at the club most past SFA presidents (all? current?) now support and protect, for there can be little doubt that TRFC’s supporters have not been receiving ‘value for money’ since the new club first entered Scottish football. Year on year, for the past five, they’ve been promised great glory, have stumped up for that glory, and have never come close to achieving it. Yet they still believe the promises they are given, year on year, at season ticket time. Over forty thousand of them have for this season!

    There is much turns the Scottish football fan off the game, but it’s not value for money, and it is seldom discussed over that proverbial pint (or even the genuine pint). While some supporters might feel they are priced out of the game, they do not think in terms of ‘value for money’, but merely that they can’t afford the ticket. On the other hand, some might decide they are not going to watch that rubbish anymore, and so stop going, regardless of the cost (cheap or dear), for the pleasure of watching their team has gone. Again, it is not the case that they feel the game, itself, isn’t worth the price of admission, more that it isn’t worth their time or the effort to attend. 

    Football supporters complain, it’s a fact of life! There’ll even be Celtic supporters complaining about yesterday’s incredible game – if only every game matched the two games between those two clubs – and, if asked a leading question, like, ‘do you think Scottish football provides value for money?’ most will, probably, say ‘no’, but asked a follow up question, like, ‘ then why do you continue to go?’ they will probably just shrug their shoulders and give a multitude of different answers, one of which is very likely to be ‘because I love my club!’

    I honestly can’t remember if I completed the questionnaire, but I am certain that the questions would have been closed questions, like, ‘do you think Scottish football provides value for money?’ with a yes or no answer, rather than the much more revealing, open question, ‘what do you think is wrong with Scottish football?’ or, ‘what do you believe is the worst thing ever to have happened in our game?’ But, of course, these are not the type of questions any PR man would suggest including in any survey, for their results would be extremely difficult, impossible probably, to spin!

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